ID3v2.3 comments not being loaded

[mim]

Hi,
I like the program very much.
Unfortunately I ran into a problem with Comments. These are not properly loaded.
In the grid I see the right Comment (as in the file tag). Only in the file, the Comment is the same for both ID3v1 and ID3v2, but when I pull up the properties, I see the Comment only in the ID3v1 version "tab"; when I move to ID3v2 for the same properties window, the Comment field is empty.
I believe similar issues occur with other tags.
I've tried different operations: refresh, rebuild with Update option, apply, even removed the dirs from the Library and added them again, but ID3v2 Comment still blank.
I know it's there becasue I check it with other tag readers.
Can you please advise?
Cheers
Mim

[jtclipper]

Send me a file to have a look please

[jtclipper]

I had a look at the file, the ID3v2 tag has the comment stored in a 'user' comment field labeled "ID3v1 Comment". You can see those in the use fields tab of the extended dialog.
In order to populate the standard comment field(frame) please go to tag panel and select batch.../Sync/Auto sync Id3 tags, that procedure will fill out empty fields from one tag to the other.

[mim]

Hi JT,
many thanks, syncing solves the problem but there are still a few strange things I do not understand.

I had a look at the file, the ID3v2 tag has the comment stored in a 'user' comment field labeled "ID3v1 Comment".

Ok, but how did it end up there? with any other tag tools, I see the comment in the ID3v2 or IDv1 "Comment" field, not in a "user" defined comment field (Comment is a standard frame in both v1 and v2, right?). I do not do any operation (e.g. copy Tag x -> Tag y) in other tools.

You can see those in the use fields tab of the extended dialog.

Yes, I did not notice that before, thx. As a matter of fact I see it also in the Main tab of the extended dialog, but it is not shown at all in the ID3v2 Properties window.

In order to populate the standard comment field(frame) please go to tag panel and select batch.../Sync/Auto sync Id3 tags, that procedure will fill out empty fields from one tag to the other.

If I do that, I see indeed the comment also in the Properties window, but it still sounds a bit misterious to me.
The problem is that I'm about to start sorting out a db of >18000 titles.
The main tool I use is TGF but input to it are files with basic Tag info (incl. Comment).
So id3v2 is already there when read by TGF for the first time. If I copy from Comment v1 to Comment v2, I will lose information because of v1 limitations.
Do you have any advise?

Maybe this problem is due to the fact that I installed TGF v81 on top of a previous version (without uninstalling it first).
How can I do a un-reinstall from scratch without losing already stored tag information (i.e. tags which are specifically defined within TGF)?

Many thanks in advance!!
Mim

[jtclipper]

ID3v2 is a complex tagging format to say the least.Because of that, many applications behave differently when they try to read and normalize the frames from it.

So in short ID3v2 allows you to have a comment without a description, which is the standard comment field applications use. It also adds to that, allowing as many other comment fields you like with a description. In fact there are many applications that use those to store 'special' information using 'user' defined comment fields.

In you file the standard comment frame (the one without a description is not there), the only comment frame has a description labeled as 'ID3v1 comment'.

If you don't want to use the sync function you can just do a scan and update, the grid will be populated with the ID3v1 comment because the ID3v2 will be considered blank.
Now the problem would be if you actually have files with this special comment field (labeled as ID3v1 comment) with data larger than 30 chars, which would be contradicting because the application that stored this field used this specific label and completely ignored the standard method.

I would like to know which other tools read this and post it in the comment field, I've tried the standard players and other tagging tools and all place it in a (user defined comment) or completely hide it.

In your case a script can be made to extract this field and store it in the appropriate place, but please check your files and see if this is actually needed ( that special field has more than 30 characters).

[mim]

Hi JT,
I've done some tests, and came to the conclusion that most likely some other app, must have created that User defined Field.
Not sure which one, since when ID3v2 std Comment is populated and User Defined Comment is empty the following apps display the Comment as expected:
- MP3 Book Helper (I use this a lot together with TGF)
- ID3 Renamer
- ID3 Synch
- ID3 TagIT
- MP3 Tag
- Pistonsoft MP3 Tag Editor
- Zortam ID3 Tag Editor

Other tools I may have used are:
- MDB2000
- Music Collector
- Gracenote Media Manager
- Magic MP3 Tagger

So, all in all, it seems limited to this specific occasion, and not a systematic behaviour.
I'll keep an eye in the future if this reoccurs and will let you know which program is creating
that field.

If it can be useful for you to know, I've done also the following.
I've redone the experiment from scratch with another file.
1) ID3v1 std comment populated, ID3v1 std comment not.
2) Copy ID3v1 to ID3v2 with MP3 Book Helper, Save and Close app.
3) In TGF, loaded the file from scratch (was not in previous Library)
4) Both std Comments (ID3v1 and ID3v2) are there correctly. User defined Comment is empty.

So far so good

5) Removed ID3v2 Comment
6) Closed TGF
7) Opened MP3 Book Helper
Std. Comment in ID3v2 removed (=> OK)
9) New std. Comment in ID3v2 manually inserted
10) Save and Close app
11) Open TGF -> Library

Now:
12) Grid and Main fields tab of the extended dialog still showing empty std. Comment.
13) Properties shows new std. Comment (as changed in point 9).
14) Done an Update of the Library (and maybe also a Refresh - don't remember exactly)
15) New std. Comment (as changed in point 9) correctly displayed in Grid and Main fields tab of the extended dialog (and of course in Properties).

So what I make from this is that Properties is always reading the actual File Tag (even if Library is not Updated/Refreshed), but in order to have actual tag info in Grid and extended dialog an Update+Refresh is needed.
This is what expected I think.

Many thanks for your support
Mim

[jtclipper]

2) Copy ID3v1 to ID3v2.

I think this might be have been the issue here with an other app or an older version, I cant be 100% sure but it feels like the copy procedure (ID3v1 to ID3v2) followed some logic to copy the ID3v1 comment into a user defined comment in ID3v2 even if the standard comment is empty.
Ideally ID3v1 and ID3v2 tags should have the same values on their common fields,there is the limitation of 30 chars in ID3v1 of course that's why they 'invented' an extension for it the LYRICS tag to further complicate things..

In TGF copy and move from one tag to the other will always use the standard fields and upon an option the LYRICS tag will be used, however unless you have some old hardware reading only ID3v1, I would suggest using/keeping only the ID3v2 tag in the future.

[mim]

I think that explains indeed.
One last question:
if I wanted to do a fresh re-install, just to be sure (i.e. uninstall old version of TGF and install latest version) without losing already stored information (not only tags but also user pre-defined values) which files would I have to preserve and then overwrite after new installation?

Many thanks!!
Pasquale

[jtclipper]

TGF writes all files to the install directory no registry values no other paths.
Any install should be a clean install , all the parameters and options are in the .ini files in case you want to make a backup and the library in the .mdb file.